Diff and general drivetrain durability vs Arrma Kraton / Notorious

[lee82gx]

How I end up coming here

Hi,
I received a recommendation that a Tekno MT410 is a much better truck than an Arrma 6s, but I'd really want to hear from the actual users on specific questions:

I bought a used but rather beat up Kraton 6s V5 that really requires a lot of repairs, on top of my own poor diff rebuilding that stripped the center diff.

So, I am considering to buy a whole new kit and retiring the Kraton, reusing the electronics. But:

In my country Tekno is only sold online by 1 electronic store and many parts are on-order, requiring at least 4 weeks lead time everytime.

Therefore the question I have is:
Is there any wisdom in just building a new MT410, stock, from scratch and running it only on 2000kv and 4s, without too much jumping and bashing but more of a "fast crawl" at say less than 40km/h top speed. As opposed to doing the same thing with a Kraton, but unfortunately I find that the drivetrain wears rather quickly - Even the manual says rebuild the diffs every 20 packs. Top it off with "shimming the diff" here and there (literally every single gear needs arbitrary amount of shimming) and then having the risk of it stripping if I don't get it just right I am wondering is this just specific to Arrma or big monster trucks in general? Not only that I see the diff outdrives being worn with every half dozen packs, requiring even more diff rebuilding and shimming.

I don't see this in Tekno manual - does this mean they are far more maintenance free in this regard?

If so, any particular spare should I standby?

Is there really no kit that I can run for a long time, without the need to do all of this di

 

[nino.]

I believe an MT410 will be more durable than any Arrma. I only have an old Kraton (v3 I think) and the design and material quality is crap compared to my SCT410. Selling the Arrma (if I don't just throw it in the trash) and if I want a basher truck again, I'm getting an MT410 for sure. They're not magic, but still very very tough.

In Europe, Microspeed and maybe 2-3 other shops have Tekno parts in stock, always.

 

[Nadboo]

I’ve had my MT410 for about 5 or so years. I’m running a Castle 2200kv, mamba monster X with 4S
Here is my list of repairs-
-Upgraded servo horn when initially building it
-upgraded to a good servo
-Diff oil change
-rebuilt shock
-New body

The end

Before I even started driving it I upgraded to a metal servo horn. Since then I have had to replace a cheap servo (my fault for going cheap) after backflips at the skate park, and the last time I went out somehow caused a shock to leak. The shock still has the plastic shock cap. I also rebuilt the rear diffs once to change the diff oil to thicker fluid. After 5 years of some bad driving, backflips, using the wheels momentum to flip the truck back on its wheels (I know I’m not supposed to do that but it’s fun) the body looked terrible and was a bit cracked so I replaced it.
I don’t think you will find a better monster truck on the market than the MT410, I can assure you getting one will be worth the wait.

 

[YourConfused]

I have a K6 and MT410, among many others, and I've only fried the electronics in my Tekno. My Kraton has survived some bad hits, like full speed into a tree, but the tekno hasn't broken anything yet. The Kraton shocks break super easily, arms and suspension pivots break, etc; so i replaced the arms with RPM, shocks with tekno nt48 shocks and built them with stock oil and springs, which are not a good match for the much heavier Arrma. I've replaced several other plastic parts on the Kraton with aluminum but stopped driving it when the ESC battery connectors began to give me issues and I've been too lazy to solder on different plugs. The K6 is really fast and fun on 6s, but i wouldn't pay full price for one after seeing what the tekno can withstand. Nothing can come close to my Losi Lasernut, for being unreliable and breaking constantly,though. That thing is great, fast fun and smooth as butter, for a few minutes at a time. Lol
My thoughts on Kraton vs MT410 actually comes down to the difference in wheelbase. The Kraton is much for stable and easier to drive at speed, especially with the stupid big tires i have on the tekno that make it flip forward and backwards constantly, but the short wheelbase doesn't help with that. If jumping is the primary use case then the tekno is the only one i would go for, but overall i find it less fun since i don't jump that often since moving. This is easily fixed by going to a longer chassis in the tekno but it's essentially the difference between the Kraton and notorious in the Arrma line.

 

[PatMarcus]

on my 410 I have broken two bodies from skatepark abuse and a rear gearbox case, which also bent the rear shock tower. It was a terrible landing that by rights should have done a ton more damage. Mine is on a maxx 8 g1/2200/19t on 4s and I’m constantly wowed by how much better it is at being a monster/stunt truck, than I am at driving it. It’s also actually really fun to drive flatout and on backflip 4s tyres I get a steady 45mph.

Having come from 6S Arrmas, here’s the amazing thing. Tekno diffs (as long as you buy the steel diff case) don’t ever seem to break. They’re beautifully machined, Accessible very quickly (6 hexes) and uncomplicated to service. They rarely need shimming. I am only running 4s but others will no doubt chip in with their 6S durability. When I go out bashing with my Arrma friends as many as 50% of them will go home from the bash with a broken diff.
The replacement Arrma diff costs soon outweigh the on-cost of having a tekno.
I also have an et48.3 basher running a 22t pinion and doing 50 mph on 4s.
I’ve never broken anything on it.

Surprise, surprise, I have a third tekno arriving soon because they’re so good.

 

[lee82gx]

Thanks for responding guys. This forum moderation thing makes it so difficult to engage.
May I ask in a bit more detail:
1. How often do you rebuild the diffs out of wear and tear necessities - not just due to a bad hit. Do you know that after xyz number of packs / mileage that yeah the diff needs new fluid and more finer tighter shimming now etc
2. Roughly how often do you have to replace the drive cups / outdrives due to wearing if any. I attach pictures of Arrma outdrives. I have no idea how long it takes to reach that stage but I reckon it’s not too long.

On top of crash repair (I don’t think Arrma plastics are that bad) those 2 things I find are really a monthly affair that i don’t really have the stomach for.

Of course I’m not asking for maintenance free forever. But some of you got me smacking my lips at 1 years worth of running without getting my heavy tools out. Believe it or not I may not really want more than that. I will likely move to another rc eventually. An FPV drone perhaps. Something that I think is simply impossible with an Arrma 6s system.

 

[RustyUs]

Thanks for responding guys. This forum moderation thing makes it so difficult to engage.
May I ask in a bit more detail:
1. How often do you rebuild the diffs out of wear and tear necessities - not just due to a bad hit. Do you know that after xyz number of packs / mileage that yeah the diff needs new fluid and more finer tighter shimming now etc
2. Roughly how often do you have to replace the drive cups / outdrives due to wearing if any. I attach pictures of Arrma outdrives. I have no idea how long it takes to reach that stage but I reckon it’s not too long.

On top of crash repair (I don’t think Arrma plastics are that bad) those 2 things I find are really a monthly affair that i don’t really have the stomach for.

Of course I’m not asking for maintenance free forever. But some of you got me smacking my lips at 1 years worth of running without getting my heavy tools out. Believe it or not I may not really want more than that. I will likely move to another rc eventually. An FPV drone perhaps. Something that I think is simply impossible with an Arrma 6s system.

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You could always reverse the direction of your front/rear diffs when you put them back in the gearbox, then reverse motor direction. Or swap left/right outdrives when rebuilding the diffs to get use of the other side of the outdrives.

All I can say is, I must not "bash" my Kraton EXB hard enough, 'cause that thing's a beast. I totally dislike the pillow ball front end of the Kraton, but I deal with it. I only got the EXB 'cause I got tired of waiting for the ET48 2.0 to come out; it being a roller, and the EXB had on it what I planned on doing with an ET48.

 

[Hector_Fisher]

There are some important things to consider when asking a "which is better" type question:
Strength does not necessarily equal durability. Quality of material matters just as much if not more than the amount of material.

I think the Arrma drivetrains are sufficient for what they do, bashing; but they are certainly not made for long wear. Perhaps my experience is anecdotal, but my SCT410.3 and MT410 have next to no wear on the drive cups and driveshaft pins after a year of bashing (4s on the SCT, 6s on the MT). The hardened, quality steel tekno uses shows. Whereas my Kraton has been bashed equally as hard, but even after a few month you could start to see indent in the drive cups and slightly mashed pin edges. It would still drive, but it's lifespan was duly noted as being shorter. As noted above, the good thing about the kraton is that you can swap diff/driveshaft orientation and get more life from your parts.

Arrma does use more material, so imo their drivetrains can take a beating just like my MT410, but they won't last nearly as long. For comparison, my two Kaijus (OG and EXT) have beefy drive pins and driveshafts. They can take a hit and hold 6s power, but they are also wearing in just like the Kraton. They are also made of the finest chinese monkey metal The good part about them at least is that fully assembled diffs can be found for ~$20. Pick your poison i guess.

 

[KnowAir]

Have both Arrma and Tekno here, amongst others.. Tekno quality is definitely a step up from Arrma, as is any race level rig in my experience. Arrma parts are cheaper and more widely available for sure, and need to be. They don't last as long, plain and simple. I have an MT410 that's over 2 years old, I've only ever ran it on 4s. Mainly because it is nearly as fast on 4 as an Arrma on 6s. Diffs in the Tekno are gold by comparison to Arrma. Not that Arrma is bad, rather just not as good. The Tekno's stay tighter for far longer than the Arrma's. I don't believe there is any area aside from price and availability where Arrma is better.
Do you have access to ebay where you are? Many kit breakers selling complete Arrma diffs on ebay rather cheaply.

 

[BashingBrian]

Tekno 10/10, Arrma 6/10
End of story..!!
I own plenty of both.....

 

[mr_joe]

Thanks for responding guys. This forum moderation thing makes it so difficult to engage.
May I ask in a bit more detail:
1. How often do you rebuild the diffs out of wear and tear necessities - not just due to a bad hit. Do you know that after xyz number of packs / mileage that yeah the diff needs new fluid and more finer tighter shimming now etc
2. Roughly how often do you have to replace the drive cups / outdrives due to wearing if any. I attach pictures of Arrma outdrives. I have no idea how long it takes to reach that stage but I reckon it’s not too long.

On top of crash repair (I don’t think Arrma plastics are that bad) those 2 things I find are really a monthly affair that i don’t really have the stomach for.

Of course I’m not asking for maintenance free forever. But some of you got me smacking my lips at 1 years worth of running without getting my heavy tools out. Believe it or not I may not really want more than that. I will likely move to another rc eventually. An FPV drone perhaps. Something that I think is simply impossible with an Arrma 6s system.

Did you end up getting one? I notice they are on sale in the UK at the moment and I'm tempted to get domething that's a bit more robust then Arrmas.

Great thread, it answered a lot of my questions

 

[lee82gx]

Did you end up getting one? I notice they are on sale in the UK at the moment and I'm tempted to get domething that's a bit more robust then Arrmas.

Great thread, it answered a lot of my questions

Unfortunately no. My LHS which happens to be online only lol is unable to source the mt410 kit because it’s listed as out of stock on the Tekno website, it’s been so for months now. I suspect they may have plans to update the model but again there is no concrete news about that either.
You may not even like the next bit of personal news, I bought another Arrma. Haha. Life is funny.

 

[Nicochau]

Unfortunately no. My LHS which happens to be online only lol is unable to source the mt410 kit because it’s listed as out of stock on the Tekno website, it’s been so for months now. I suspect they may have plans to update the model but again there is no concrete news about that either.
You may not even like the next bit of personal news, I bought another Arrma. Haha. Life is funny.

There are mentions of an MT410 2.0 that would likely reuse parts from the SCT410 2.0 all over Tekno’s website. So it is not a stretch to think the wait won’t be long.

 

[mr_joe]

Unfortunately no. My LHS which happens to be online only lol is unable to source the mt410 kit because it’s listed as out of stock on the Tekno website, it’s been so for months now. I suspect they may have plans to update the model but again there is no concrete news about that either.
You may not even like the next bit of personal news, I bought another Arrma. Haha. Life is funny.

Ahhhh haha. Which one did you get?

There are mentions of an MT410 2.0 that would likely reuse parts from the SCT410 2.0 all over Tekno’s website. So it is not a stretch to think the wait won’t be long.

I just bought an MT410 at my hobby shop for just over half price. They told me a new MT is expected end of the year hence their discounted prices

 

[KnowAir]

While I have no actual info on the next MT410, based on what we have seen with the SCT, pretty safe to say it'll be much the same as the previous version but with 2.0 parts instead of .3 parts. Just a guess.

 

[lee82gx]

Ahhhh haha. Which one did you get?

I just bought an MT410 at my hobby shop for just over half price. They told me a new MT is expected end of the year hence their discounted prices

Long story, I got a Notorious 6s. Sold my beat up Kraton for a penny, then found another used but almost new one for even cheaper so now i have a lot of explaining to do with my wife. 1/2 price for a mt410 is a great buy.
Edit - I suppose no point speculating about the new mt until it’s announced…

 

[Nicochau]

Ahhhh haha. Which one did you get?

I just bought an MT410 at my hobby shop for just over half price.

Well done!

 

[nino.]

While I have no actual info on the next MT410, based on what we have seen with the SCT, pretty safe to say it'll be much the same as the previous version but with 2.0 parts instead of .3 parts. Just a guess.

Same same but different. The 410 2.0 SCT barely has any compatible parts with the 410.3.

 

[KnowAir]

Same same but different. The 410 2.0 SCT barely has any compatible parts with the 410.3.

Guess that's what I was trying to say. The next MT410 will likely be a mixture of 2.0 parts instead of a mixture of .3 parts. Aside from the newer "2.0 bin parts", I can't imagine there will be any performance or durability advantage of MT410 2.0 over the previous .3 version.

 

[Nicochau]

Guess that's what I was trying to say. The next MT410 will likely be a mixture of 2.0 parts instead of a mixture of .3 parts. Aside from the newer "2.0 bin parts", I can't imagine there will be any performance or durability advantage of MT410 2.0 over the previous .3 version.

100%

Stock body posts and towers look beefier, but most hard core basher have already ported M2C towers / Arrma posts to their MT410…